Things that are crazy

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch) 06/24/2019 at 12:44 • Filed to: None

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I was chatting with my neighbor about boats the other day and I realized it had been a while since I was up to date with ski (surf) boat prices. Dayum.

So this is A centurion Ri237. Its their 2nd to top model surf boat and it is (at the end of the day) a lot of vinyl , stitching, electrical, fiberglass and a GM small block with a single speed transmission and v-drive with a smattering of high end electronic work.

Want to ha zard a guess on the msrp?

No cheating.

I mean its got some cool features, but how do people afford these things? Sadly I know the answer and its 30 years loans.  30!

This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja: > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 12:58

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They won’t even give us 30 year mortgages anymore. Jeesh.

I won't even hazard a guess. More than I'd be willing to consider, I'm sure.

Future next gen S2000 owner > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 12:58

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125K+ All day. I’m not surprised at 30 year loans. My boat aspirations are much more meager, but the boat fund is growing!

Also, if it doesn’t at least run the 6.2, hard pass. I s the 6.2 a small block?

MUSASHI66 > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 12:58

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I thought it’d be $30k so I double it and some to $65k. Then I looked up the price. Dayummmmm

HammerheadFistpunch > Future next gen S2000 owner 06/24/2019 at 12:59

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HammerheadFistpunch > MUSASHI66 06/24/2019 at 13:00

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yeah.

Future next gen S2000 owner > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:00

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160K?

Ash78, voting early and often > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:02

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If it has a toilet, you can get a mortgage on it. You can always just pee off the side. INSTANT TOILET

Nothing > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:03

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I know my buddy “paid” 6 figures  for his Supra. In Colorado, a place with very little good water to get out on without bumping into 250000 other boats, or still dodging chunks of ice. I remember when I thought 10 year boat loans were absurd...

HammerheadFistpunch > Future next gen S2000 owner 06/24/2019 at 13:07

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closer. And the GM 6.2 is indeed a small block. They use PCM marine engines (marinized GM) and claim 410 hp and 545 lbs-ft but it’ s the same engine (more or less) as the Mercruiser 370 which has 370 hp. the long and skinny of it is that PCM lies, which is why Centu rion switched suppliers because buyers are wowed by numbers and no one is keeping marine manufacture honest.

HammerheadFistpunch > Nothing 06/24/2019 at 13:08

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Same story in Utah.  Massively popular here, but for reasons I don’t fully comprehend.  When the next economic crisis comes there is going to be a plethora of lightly used fancy boats on the market.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:08

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I’ve looked at some boat prices recently so I’m going to wager $110k

farscythe - makin da cawfee! > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:10

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welp.... its out of my budget

guess ill stick to boating about in the shoe

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:11

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You could buy like 30 of these, then fly all of OPPO to Utah for an offroad vacation. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:11

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You could buy like 30 of these, then fly all of OPPO to Utah for an offroad vacation. 

HammerheadFistpunch > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 06/24/2019 at 13:11

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HammerheadFistpunch > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 06/24/2019 at 13:12

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Pretty much.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:12

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I’ll also add that boat loans are stupidly easy to get for  absurdly long lengths of time. When we bought our boat we got a loan initially with the plan to pay it off within a year so I didn’t shop around and just let the dealer find a loan for us. I gave them no numbers like monthly payments or length of the loan that I expected, they came back with a 10 year loan. This was for a 20 year old boat!

HammerheadFistpunch > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 06/24/2019 at 13:12

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its an easy asset to repo.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:13

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$180k? Where do people find this kind of money? 

Nothing > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:15

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My cousin back in NY is an avid skier, used to ski competitively. He always has about a 10 year old Mastercraft Prostar he picks up from buddies that replace their boats. I still love the old Correct Craft Ski Nautiques from the ‘80s. If I were to boat, I’d probably look at about a 15-20 year old ski boat. I love em. Even then, that would be more than I would want to spend.

HammerheadFistpunch > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 06/24/2019 at 13:16

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I have no idea.  How do you pull off the inland beach bum thing AND the disposable 6 figure toy thing.  Its a mystery. 

benjrblant > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:17

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i can’t fathom the cost and expense of everything related to boating. it makes no sense to me.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:19

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Even with a 30 year loan, that’s basically my mortgage payment and probably more when you factor in the higher interest rates a boat loan will have.

HammerheadFistpunch > Nothing 06/24/2019 at 13:19

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yeah, a 3 seat flat bottom inline boat would be a fun toy, but they make CRAPPY all rounders. We used to have an American Skier Volante and it was the WORST boat in anything but glass.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:19

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Boats are crazy expensive, I just don’t get it either.

The only boat I have any interest in is one that is currently sitting in my in-law’s pasture in rural Maine begging for a renovation. My wife’s dad built it by hand many years ago as part of a boat building class he taught (he is a very talented carpenter and built wooden boats for a career…mostly in the millions for super rich folks). This boat is a small wooden thing and funny enough my wife was named after the boat (not the other way around)…would be a great family heirloom to bring back to life and keep. But I keep hearing that owning a boat is like throwing money away, which worries me because we definitely don’t have a budget for routine boat maintenance…hopefully that’s mostly applies to newer fancier boats?

I know nothing about them so should probably start off by asking the FIL what it would take to renovate the old thing, and what upkeep would look like afterwards.

HammerheadFistpunch > benjrblant 06/24/2019 at 13:20

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buy used and do your own maintenance and expect to fix something on it at least once a year and it’ s not untenable .

HammerheadFistpunch > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 06/24/2019 at 13:21

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its actually a little higher than my mortgage payment. 

His Stigness > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:22

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A 30 year loan???

So that means boats appreciate in value, right?!? 

HammerheadFistpunch > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 06/24/2019 at 13:22

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I love being on the boat and there is nothing quite like it for bringing people together...but...you have to go in eyes wide open.

MattHurting > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:24

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So how is it 2-3x more expensive than this?

https://www.nitro.com/2019-z-series-bass-boats/z21.html

Future next gen S2000 owner > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 06/24/2019 at 13:31

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A full renovation can be pricey. Costs of owning vary a lot. Routine maintenance is critical to avoid hugely expensive repairs.

Think about it this way, es pecially with older boats, you are using a piece of wood and fiberglass in the water. Water is no good for wood. It’s only a matter of time until a boat goes soft and the stringers and transom are rotten. Motor’s aren’t too bad, especially if you go DIY. It’s the rotten wood and fiberglass repair that will get you. Frisco Boater replaced his floor and transom on his 23' late 90's boat. It was somewhere around 5K in supplies alone, and this was a few years ago.

Future next gen S2000 owner > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:33

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I don’t understand how 3 manufacturers can all take the same engines and get the various numbers. Volvo is usually within 5-10 hp of Mercruiser. That could be a tune but 40 hp is a lot.

Sovande > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 06/24/2019 at 13:35

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I have a boat that is fiberglass and was built in 1979 (with a much newer engine). I would guess that over the 9 years we have owned it we have put in about $6000 in repairs and maintenance.  I’d consider this to be fairly cheap.  That cost includes a new deck that my father and I installed a few years ago that cost about $2400 in supplies only.  

I wouldn’t imagine a wooden boat will be any cheaper.  There is a lot of maintenance to do with a wooden boat, especially once it has been out of the water for an extended period of time.

Sovande > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:37

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The median home price in my city is $520,000 so that makes this boat loan sound like a bargain!

HammerheadFistpunch > His Stigness 06/24/2019 at 13:38

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Totally...

HammerheadFistpunch > MattHurting 06/24/2019 at 13:38

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they are 2-3x more boat by weight.

ItalianJobR53 - now with added 'MERICA and unreliability > Future next gen S2000 owner 06/24/2019 at 13:46

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Different headers and intakes?

My LS6 is supposed to gain 40whp with some good headers

HammerheadFistpunch > Future next gen S2000 owner 06/24/2019 at 13:47

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Like I said, PCM straight lies.

https://ww3.arb.ca.gov/msprog/offroad/cert/cert_results.php?order=0

This is what their 6.2 engines ACTUALLY produce even though they claim 450 HP for MY 2019.

HammerheadFistpunch > Sovande 06/24/2019 at 13:51

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its $423,000 here, but all that means is that more of your money is going to a home rather than toys.  

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 13:55

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Yikes yeah the responses to my post indicate as much...definitely don’t have that kind of money and the renovation will absolutely be a crazy undertaking. FIL would no doubt like to do it himself but even the materials will be crazy expensive I suspect.

Perhaps it should continue to just sit as an interesting garden fixture for the fo reseeable future...

HammerheadFistpunch > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 06/24/2019 at 13:56

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You could take it on slowly.  learn a new skill and connect with your FIL.  Might be a win win

The Ghost of Oppo > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 06/24/2019 at 13:59

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It’s easy to find when you pay your employees as little as possible with raises that don’t match inflation   and provide the bare minimum in benefits.

Nothing > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:03

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Ya know, that’s a good point. I won’t be buying a boat here, but if I did, it’s pretty windy along the front range which make for some chop. Our camp in NY, the water is usually glass. We try and rent a boat at least once/yr here, and the water is seldom good for anything except tubing.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:08

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He’s a great guy and as fun as that would be, we’re on opposite coasts. As with other joint projects we’ve undertaken I don’t want it to turn in to him getting suckered in to putting all the time in himself. He misses his craft and it’s probably something he’d love doing regardless though for my wife, especially at least if we come to an agreement for us to cover the cost.

And then we’ve also been thinking aloud about how awesome it’d be to drive Route 20 (supposedly the country’s longest road) from Boston (he grew up in Wayland, MA right outside Boston with 20 running by their doorstep) to Portland (where we live…well to Newport, OR where 20 actually ends).

Would be a pretty epic way to move the boat to the west coast while getting a proper cross-country road trip in too…but these are just dreams at this point. My wife and MIL have no desire in being stuck in a car for so long, but I know it’s something my FIL wants to do again someday now that he’s retired and sounds pretty awesome to me.

Tripper > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:09

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Financing on boats is W I L D

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:11

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Ken Block has a cool one with a 6.2L Raptor motor in it thats got a bunch of Roush parts on it. The joys of having a basically limitless income and corporate sponsors

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:14

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not if its 16 feet under water

Tripper > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:14

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I turn down a boat ride 0/10 times. I buy gas/bring beers and help wash the boat afterward for my pals that have em. Afterward I always think, “I want a boat”. Then I think, “nah I just need to hang out with so and so more.”

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:16

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this his bring me more coke face

Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing. > benjrblant 06/24/2019 at 14:19

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If you think boating is bad, try aviation...

cmill189 - sans Volvo > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:25

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The same goes for how many people “afford” new RV ’s.

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:47

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I learned Correct Craft owns Centurion Boats, I guess that explains the pricing. I prefer my completely rebuilt 1985 Ski Nautique with a 454 BBC. I have about $ 9,000 in it after getting it for free.

HammerheadFistpunch > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 06/24/2019 at 14:50

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really? that's news to me but i guess it explains why the centurion dealer is also a supra dealer.

StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:52

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I really want a Super Air Nautique GS22 or the like, but damn are they expensive.  Best bet on a boat like that is to get it maybe 5 years down the road when they are cheaper.  Boats are crazy expensive.

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 14:53

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Yeah

https://www.correctcraft.com/our-brands/

They own a lot including PCM Engines, I honestly thought they were just the Nautique stuff. 

Future next gen S2000 owner > ItalianJobR53 - now with added 'MERICA and unreliability 06/24/2019 at 14:59

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I’m skeptical that headers are good for 40 hp. Modern motors are so good. I almost think you need a cam, headers, and intake for a legit 40hp.

fintail > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 15:10

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I was thinking 150K, not too bad.

There must be an enormous amount of over-leveraged people out there, not sure how they stay afloat even with a 200+ month term, along with a usually bloated mortgage, car payments, coddled devilspawn, etc.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > The Ghost of Oppo 06/24/2019 at 15:11

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How are there that many business owners/CEOs though? There are too many people with too much money...and this becomes extremely obvious the longer you hang around the boat scene

Sammyno55 > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 15:17

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I have a friend with a 1982 Ski Natique he got for the low price of $towitoffmyproperty. Just went out on the lake with garage sale period correct trick skis and short swim trunks. #retroskiboat ftw!

HammerheadFistpunch > StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 06/24/2019 at 15:33

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we bought 2008 enzo 240 and it was still expensive

StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 > HammerheadFistpunch 06/24/2019 at 15:49

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Unless you can afford it, there really isn’t a reason to buy a brand new boat.  If it’s been taken care of, might as well let someone else take the depreciation hit.

HammerheadFistpunch > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 06/24/2019 at 17:31

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Sounds the the start of a really great story.  

functionoverfashion > HammerheadFistpunch 06/25/2019 at 23:10

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I just stumbled on this and yes, so much yes. This is crazy and this bubble has to burst. Right? 

If you look at a plain old direct drive inboard from 1990, their prices were comparable to 3-series BMWs. Now, the same direct-drive closed bow tournament inboard is more like 7-series money (looking specifically at Nautiques). WTF, man, it’s nuts.

I dabble in the Nautique forums and once in a while someone will come on with an older boat (like mine!) and say, “hey just out of curiosity, what do y’all do for work that you can afford these new boats?!” And.... crickets.